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Postby Shixam » Tue Sep 01, 2015 11:14 pm

Please Note: Please, no C/C from judges for this round. It got really stressful in Round 1, and I would prefer saving something for the feedback portion of the pageant.

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Last edited by Shixam on Wed Sep 30, 2015 8:02 pm, edited 24 times in total.

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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Gwen » Wed Sep 02, 2015 12:45 pm

Wow the skin shading though!! :o it looks great.
I think the outfit you're going for so far really works and is a good grunge look. I don't have any CC at the moment, but \o/ yay encouragement. I also found this http://firstfear.deviantart.com/art/Tut ... -186905976 if you choose to go for flowers, idk how much it helps. I usually just blob a shape and then add shading until it resembles something that looks like a flower D:
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Shixam » Wed Sep 02, 2015 1:34 pm

Oh man, I'm so glad the skin shading looks nice because I literally spent days on it and I don't want to have to keep messing with it when I still have the outfit to finish xD

Anyway, I wish I still loved the original concept as much as everyone else who saw the old version seemed to. But as time went on, I kept feeling more and unhappy with it and I had to come up with something new. Since I actually managed to get this sketch done in less than a day, I'm assuming that means I like it now xD I definitely saved that tutorial on dA, though! That way I'll have it in the future whenever I decide to attempts flowers again. Thanks, Gwen!

I'm hoping it has enough accessories, since that was one of my pieces of feedback. I made sure to use the glasses and the bracelet from my board because of it, and I found a different necklace to use through google and added a little pin to her beanie. I can't think of much else to add to it accessories-wise. But if there are ideas without going over, I'm open to them.

But I think it helps now that this design feels a lot more like the character, and reminds me a lot less of MIranda from Lizzie McGuire (I think it was the hair).

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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Dragyn » Wed Sep 02, 2015 6:17 pm

So. I do like the new design. But... TBH I don't think it's going to win you any points with the judges. It's reallllly similar to your audition round. I would maybe go for jeans instead of the shorts and maybe something other than a crop top. I like the accessories (the glasses, the beanie, etc.) and the intention of the plaid but I think right now it's really close to the first one.

I would try a loose drapey tank or something (like Joce would wear XD) or maybe put a plaid shirt tied around her waist instead or something.

You're going in the right direction though!
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Shixam » Wed Sep 02, 2015 7:26 pm

Damnit. I was afraid of that.

I'm really, really attached to the idea of the leggings, though, so I knew I was going to end up with either the dress, skirts, or shorts. And the dress and skirts weren't cooperating, so I think the shorts are going to stay for as long as I can manage to keep them. xD

I'll definitely try to find a different top, though, once I'm able to get back to work on it (at work on mobile right now). Thanks, Bree!

Maybe I can find something with a cute design/graphic on it to use.

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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Gwen » Wed Sep 02, 2015 11:35 pm

Shixam wrote:Oh man, I'm so glad the skin shading looks nice because I literally spent days on it and I don't want to have to keep messing with it when I still have the outfit to finish xD

Anyway, I wish I still loved the original concept as much as everyone else who saw the old version seemed to. But as time went on, I kept feeling more and unhappy with it and I had to come up with something new. Since I actually managed to get this sketch done in less than a day, I'm assuming that means I like it now xD I definitely saved that tutorial on dA, though! That way I'll have it in the future whenever I decide to attempts flowers again. Thanks, Gwen!

I'm hoping it has enough accessories, since that was one of my pieces of feedback. I made sure to use the glasses and the bracelet from my board because of it, and I found a different necklace to use through google and added a little pin to her beanie. I can't think of much else to add to it accessories-wise. But if there are ideas without going over, I'm open to them.

But I think it helps now that this design feels a lot more like the character, and reminds me a lot less of MIranda from Lizzie McGuire (I think it was the hair).


The skin shading is awesome! You definitely did a great job, the cool shadows on the skin really take it to the next notch. No problem, I hope that tutorial helps! :D I really like your new design too. I know in a lot of the grunge I've seen they have a lot of chunky bracelets, spikes and crosses. So possibly any of those could be a good accessory?
I hope you don't mind but I redlined the boots a little, getting it a little closer to the one on the board.
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The one facing forward is at just enough of an angle that I'm not sure if I got it quite right, but the shoe has a dramatic arch because of the heel. I think my redline might be a bit off because the heeled boot on the board has even more of an arch, but it's still kind of the same concept. It also is kind of pointed, so I tried to show that as well? I hope that helps a little :oops: if you didn't want CC or redlines I'm really sorry!
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Artzygrrl » Thu Sep 03, 2015 7:54 am

^ I like Gwen's redline, tho I would add that boots like this don't have a completely flat sole on the front, the front should curve upward a bit more. But that's a tiny detail!

I like the leggings, myself, and though you do want to be careful (in general) not to make your entries too samey, I think it's def on the right track. Love the vibe, it feels very grunge. :)
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Shixam » Thu Sep 03, 2015 4:52 pm

...Nobody ask me how. But my brain totally blocked out the fact that those shoes actually have a heel xD

Thanks for the redlines, Gwen!

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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Shixam » Thu Sep 03, 2015 9:08 pm

Okay, so double post, but the shoes are fixed and I have options up!

I started out doing just a tank top, like Bree suggested, and while looking up references I saw one picture where one girl's bra (I'm assuming a bra) was showing underneath. And I know it's not a bra exactly, but it reminded me of the crop top, so I thought I'd try a version with the crop top showing underneath. And then I thought, "Well, why not have the vest too then?"

So we have a version with just the tank top, a version with the tank top AND crop top, and a version with all three, though you can barely even see the crop top (It's peeking over the edge of the tank top in the third one).

I wasn't sure about putting anything around her waist, since I made the tank top so low, but I'm going to see if I can figure out something to peek out under her tank top near where her hand is on her waist now that I'm thinking about it.

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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Gwen » Thu Sep 03, 2015 10:39 pm

I really love the second one, but the third one has nice use of layering and it'd be a shame for that plaid to go to waste!! If you go for the second one have you considered tying a plaid flannel longsleeve around her waist? :D and the boots look great, perhaps a little bit of a point on the end of the boot sticking outward to match the one on the board? I really like it though it has a great grunge feel to it and the necklace is a nice accessory/ detail. The chunky bracelet is nice too \o/
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Artzygrrl » Fri Sep 04, 2015 3:16 pm

LOVE where it's going, Shix. Can't wait to see her all finished. :D
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Shixam » Fri Sep 04, 2015 10:47 pm

OKAY! UPDATE!

I decided on version 2, with the tank top/crop top combo, and Bree gave me some CC to help balance out everything out and keep the plaid by having Lilly holding a long sleeve shirt.

I've also officially started working on shading everything that I know is permanent.

Edit: Also, if anyone spots a palette that they think needs more contrast or more shades, I'd appreciate if you guys pointed it out! :D

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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Artzygrrl » Sat Sep 05, 2015 10:56 am

Looking real good~ I like the idea of her holding the plaid shirt. Nice touch! I couldn't figure out how to redline it & show what I wanted, so I just redrew a suggestion for the boots. xD The front of the boots on there now seem a bit...cut off? Is the best description. I fiddled around with it for awhile (boy did you pick a difficult boot design xD) and got what I think is pretty close to the shape of the boots. It involves looking at the way the sole goes around the boot at the front edge and where the "bend" of the foot is inside the boot, if that makes sense. This is just a rough suggestion, so hopefully you get what I mean (and hopefully it is helpful!):
Image I also added the tread to the bottom of the boot because why not. :D

Ooh! Your question about palettes made me think. You will probably want to add some purples into the shadows of every part of your doll (clothes, hair & all), even if it's really really subtle. It will help the whole doll tie together. :)

This is coming together really well. You should be proud <3
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Parker » Sat Sep 05, 2015 1:31 pm

I have some CC for the shoes and some tips so you can fix them now and work more easily on your future entries.

I looked for the exact pose you're using and, as I feared, the legs are a bit of a mess.

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I started redlining over the original base. My biggest issue with this pose is that her right (our left) foot is pointing forward, when it should be pointing slightly to her right. Try making that pose: you will automatically have your feet pointing outwards from your centre. Her left (our right) leg goes all the way to her left, against the general direction of her whole body. Her left foot also seems to be floating and has no character. It's just lying there. This affects how you've outlined the boot on that foot and gives it a weird, shapeless look.

On the second image here, I was zoomed in on the legs and didn't notice that fixing the foot was not enough, since the direction of her left leg goes against the movement of the rest of her body: her hips look as if they were thrusting forward slightly, and her left leg seems to be escaping from it. That's why I tried to relax her pose by having both legs point slightly outward. I shortened her left thigh in the process which is too long on the original base, and gave it a rounder shape. It may still need some relaxation applied to that leg, but it's better. I also shaped her feet according to the shoes she'll be wearing. Look for feet references.

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After the feet crisis was solved, I started sketching the shoes. Clothes have their own structure, which is used to shape the human body. High-heeled shoes make feet look more delicate and slender by raising the heel and accentuating their natural arch. Even shoes with such a big platform follow this logic. I always start by looking carefully at my base's feet (or my edits of them), and both my anatomy and shoe reference. Especially if I'm recreating a pre-existing model. If you take a look at how she's standing on her feet, you will notice that they're standing in a 3/4 position. This means that we won't be getting a perfect view of the sexy arch and heel, because they will be covered by the front of the shoe.

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Look at references or your own feet: you will notice the curve next to you big toe, where the arch of your feet starts. In the image above it's next to where it says "callus". That's where most of your weight rests when you wear heels. I add a straight horizontal line there to indicate that that part rests flat against the sole and that it's the lowest point of the feet. The straight line simply marks the beginning of the feet's arch, AND the shape of that curve next to the big toe. I think that's the joint between the phalanges and the metatarsals, which juts out as the toes are bent forward.

Adding those lines I show in my sketch, helps me to find out where the main features of the shoes will be placed. I then use that to block in the shoes, by using simple lines. I prefer straight lines because they're easy to draw and allows me to add some perspective if necessary. I use a square shape for the tip of the shoe for this same reason. I start by drawing a vertical line where the metatarsals start and a horizontal line for the sole under the toes. I then draw the square for the tip and simply follow the feet contours to add the lighter parts of the shoe. Platforms are an extension of the shoes's sole, so I leave them for last.

Feet need to be secured so you don't break an ankle while walking, so the bottom part of shoes tend to be more solid and stiff, while the top parts (those that cover the top part of the shoe) tend to be lighter. As a result, the solid parts will have a shape of their own, while the lighter ones can be altered. You can have folds at the top near the ankle, but you won't have any around the heels or the toe area. This structure is what will guide you through the shading stage. You'll have highlights around the metatarsal joint next to the big toe, around the heel and over the toes. You'll also have them over the top part of the arch, but it won't be as soft as the previous ones, since that part can have patterns, folds, laces etc. If you take a look at my shaded shoes, the lightest highlights are all over the stiff parts of the shoes, whereas the top of the arch is muter and foldy.

I think that the rest of the images are pretty clear, but if you need more help, let me know.
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Shixam » Sat Sep 05, 2015 2:10 pm

Wow, that was a lot to take in XD

So, do I basically have to redraw the entire lower body, essentially? I'm not sure I'm comfortable doing that this late, considering I won't be dolling today because of work and I don't know if I'll have time tomorrow. So I'll have to try to finish it up in three days starting Monday, and all the shading I still have to do is making me really anxious.

Plus, my base drawing skills aren't that good, and I'm afraid I might just make it look worse xD

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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Parker » Sat Sep 05, 2015 2:18 pm

It's a lot to think of, but that's what makes a good doll. In any case, think of this as a new approach to drawing and I'm sure you'll find it easier with practice.

No, you don't need to redraw the body, but you may want to try editing her shoes/feet a bit and see if it looks better. I think fixing the shoes will be easier with those few tweaks. Besides, since you still haven't shaded her leggings, you can try shading them so they look slightly forward and not all the way to her left.
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Artzygrrl » Sat Sep 05, 2015 4:27 pm

^Yeah, I think Parker explained it a bit better than I did. I usually just ignore the feet on bases anyway and put them where I want xD I think if you fix the feet the rest of the legs will work fine with some creatively placed shading.
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Shixam » Sun Sep 06, 2015 12:55 pm

Okay, so Bree helped me work out how to fix the legs so I did that today and redid the shoes. I still need to redraw the jacket/shirt (I keep calling it different things in my mind), but my wrist hurts and I don't want to think about redoing all that plaid right now so I'm going to do that tomorrow.

The hard part is done, though.

From here on out, I'm going to have to request for no more C/C about the base, though. It's just too late for me to do anything else and I need to focus on getting the jacket and shading done right now so I can get this in on time.

I'll definitely pay more attention to the pose I choose in the future, though.

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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Gwen » Sun Sep 06, 2015 1:13 pm

It looks really good Shix :D that leg edit is nice and so are the shoes!
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Artzygrrl » Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:22 pm

Yes!! I agree! We will cheer you to the finish line :)
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby 4br4 » Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:25 pm

Ok I've mostly been lurking b/c I love your entry-I hope your wrist feels better, and ahhh I hope you finish, gorgeous entry! <3
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Shixam » Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:50 pm

Thanks, guys! I'm gonna get back on it in a few minutes here once I finish checking all my sites. The goal for today is get all the upper body shaded and then work on the lower body tomorrow.

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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Shixam » Mon Sep 07, 2015 11:08 pm

Okay, torso and up is shaded! Hopefully it's not too terrible and I can fix any issues between tomorrow and wednesday.

I'm gonna stop and take a break for the night. Play some games on my tablet before bed.

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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby AxxKat » Tue Sep 08, 2015 9:18 am

Shixy I know I can't offer much for CC but I love the direction she's going in and her shoes look so badass <3 you're doing great! :D
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Re: Shix's NTD Thread

Postby Artzygrrl » Tue Sep 08, 2015 2:28 pm

I do have a bit of C/C on the top, but want to make sure you have time to finish the rest of her. So, I'm going to wait till you've gotten the boots, leggings, & shorts done. :P Also I don't want you to feel hen-pecked by my C/C, because you have followed SO MUCH advice this round, and this is looking amazing, so don't think everyone isn't super impressed, because WE TOTES ARE <3
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